Videos showing clips of Hillary Clinton and Nancy Pelosi saying it's patriotic to dissent:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJxmpTMGhU0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5GuzruICwQ&feature=fvw
USA Today Op-Ed Co-written by Nancy Pelosi and Steny Hyer
'Un-American' attacks can't derail health care debate
By Nancy Pelosi and Steny Hoyer
Americans have been waiting for nearly a century for quality, affordable health care.
Health coverage for all was on the national agenda as early as 1912, thanks to Teddy Roosevelt's Bull Moose presidential run. Months after World War II came to an end in 1945, President Harry Truman called on Congress to guarantee all Americans the "right to adequate medical care and protection from the economic fears of sickness." From President Lyndon Johnson to President Bill Clinton, to President Obama's winning campaign on the promise of reform, there hasn't been a more debated domestic issue than the promise of affordable health care for all.
(Steny Hoyer)
(Nancy Pelosi/USA TODAY)
We believe it is healthy for such a historic effort to be subject to so much scrutiny and debate. The failure of past attempts is a reminder that health insurance reform is a defining moment in our nation's history — it is well worth the time it takes to get it right. We are confident that we will get this right.
Already, three House committees have passed this critical legislation and over August, the two of us will work closely with those three committees to produce one strong piece of legislation that the House will approve in September.
In the meantime, as members of Congress spend time at home during August, they are talking with their constituents about reform. The dialogue between elected representatives and constituents is at the heart of our democracy and plays an integral role in assuring that the legislation we write reflects the genuine needs and concerns of the people we represent.
However, it is now evident that an ugly campaign is underway not merely to misrepresent the health insurance reform legislation, but to disrupt public meetings and prevent members of Congress and constituents from conducting a civil dialogue. These tactics have included hanging in effigy one Democratic member of Congress in Maryland and protesters holding a sign displaying a tombstone with the name of another congressman in Texas, where protesters also shouted "Just say no!" drowning out those who wanted to hold a substantive discussion.
Let the facts be heard
These disruptions are occurring because opponents are afraid not just of differing views — but of the facts themselves. Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American. Drowning out the facts is how we failed at this task for decades.
Health care is complex. It touches every American life. It drives our economy. People must be allowed to learn the facts.
The first fact is that health insurance reform will mean more patient choice. It will allow every American who likes his or her current plan to keep it. And it will free doctors and patients to make the health decisions that make the most sense, not the most profits for insurance companies.
Reform will mean stability and peace of mind for the middle class. Never again will medical bills drive Americans into bankruptcy; never again will Americans be in danger of losing coverage if they lose their jobs or if they become sick; never again will insurance companies be allowed to deny patients coverage because of pre-existing conditions.
Lower costs, better care
Reform will mean affordable coverage for all Americans. Our plan's cost-lowering measures include a public health insurance option to bring competitive pressure to bear on rapidly consolidating private insurers, research on health outcomes to better inform the decisions of patients and doctors, and electronic medical records to help doctors save money by working together. For seniors, the plan closes the notorious Medicare Part D "doughnut hole" that denies drug coverage to those with between $2,700 and $6,100 per year in prescriptions.
Reform will also mean higher-quality care by promoting preventive care so health problems can be addressed before they become crises. This, too, will save money. We'll be a much healthier country if all patients can receive regular checkups and tests, such as mammograms and diabetes exams, without paying a dime out-of-pocket.
This month, despite the disruptions, members of Congress will listen to their constituents back home and explain reform legislation. We are confident that our principles of affordable, quality health care will stand up to any and all critics.
Now — with Americans strongly supporting health insurance reform, with Congress reaching consensus on a plan, and with a president who ran and won on this specific promise of change — America is closer than ever to this century-deferred goal.
This fall, at long last, we must reach it.
John Lewis
Wow...Pelosi actually kept it together with a little more class than Hilary.
I actually think they are starting to encourage the media "scourge" of Hilary in order to take so much attention from Hit*ler...um...I mean Obama.
1I agree with both of these ladies and I agree with all the town hall speakers were assertive yet respectful of their fellow participants in getting their questions out.
What I have a problem with are participants who hijack a town hall and whip what could have been an information gathering experience into a shouting match by taking their language and actions to a level that polarizes the affair.
Although I don't really care for her in all fairness I have to say I think it's complete nonsense that conservative pundits are reporting that Speaker Pelosi is suggesting that the people who get up and speak out/protest are Nazi's. It's pretty obvious that the Speaker was referring to those who brought signs of the swastika and only those who brought signs of the swastika. To suggest that she is saying that any one who issues decent is acting like a Nazi is intellectually dishonest.
Has Pelosi ever been intellectually dishonest sure she has but I don't care about her. I care about the misinformation we're all getting that is mind F'ing us and cultivating meaningless arguments that are based on misinformation to begin with. My advise is to filter all pundits with solid dose of reason.
2hypno, I would agree with you if only Pelosi had used 1/10th that rhetoric about those out of control "protesters" during the Bush years. BTW those posters pf obama with the Hitler moustache have been identified as Known Obama/left wing activists in a number of cases. Not one case of a Sign carried by a known Republican/conservative activist. I would recommend you read The book "Rules for Radicals" by Saul D. Alinsky
3I don't think it's unpatriotic to dissent and I'm even okay with protesters who stand outside the town hall meetings with their signs, but I can't stand the ones who comes inside while I'm trying to listen to my representative and shout out stuff like "you're a socialist" or "you're lying." I'm there to be better informed and to not let me hear is disrespectful and a bad way to get a point across.
4I agree genesis, no matter who's doing the shouting. Wait for your turn at the mike, and then let the representative know how you feel, but be respectful.
5Did I miss something? Did someone say dissent is unpatriotic? I'm lost as to what these videos are a response to.
6"I actually think they are starting to encourage the media "scourge" of Hilary in order to take so much attention from Hit*ler...um...I mean Obama."
I think I just sprained a rectus muscle from that eye roll.
7Me too, TS.
8Pelosi has called the dissenters Un-American.
9Oh I agree grandpa the Speaker should have shared the same sentiment no matter who is in the Oval office.
I also do not have a problem with what protesters do on the out side it's on the inside where most people are there to listen, learn and ask questions that I feel some self control would be respectful of our fellow constituents. No one is saying don't speak your mind but there should also be no reason why you can't express your anger and frustration with out going bananas and the benefit is all yours when you do that. Your point is heard, understood and addressed but if you go nuts it's all about the confrontation.
10All I can find is an op-ed where Pelosi said "Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American."
And I don't see anything about how this relates to Senator Clinton? I'm just confused here. We decided/voted not to restrict content posted in this group, but I do think it's a bit easier when we have an article or facts to discuss so we're all on the same page.
11Pelosi said "Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American."
She said this? WOW. Was she saying it 5 years ago when Code Pink and the other "George Bush hate groups" were busy drowning out the oppositions message? If you really want to talk about un-American, it's only caring about the people who voted for you that is truly un-American.
12Yeah, this is silly. Can we please get something where either of these women call some one unpatriotic for dissent so that this post makes sense?
All we have is a video montage of unattractive photos of HRC while audio of her giving a speech in 2003 plays over it and a video of Pelosi saying that dissent is patriotic. Where are they saying it isn't?
All I am finiding is a quote where she says, "Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American." Which is not the same as saying dissent is un-American.
13comparing any President to H.itler is lame whether its Bush or Obama lets all agree to stop doing that please.
14I agree CG! Lets hug on it!
15comparing any President to H.itler is lame whether its Bush or Obama lets all agree to stop doing that please.
What a swell idea!
16Well isn't the Speaker quoted as saying that some of these protesters are "un-American"?
I don't presume to speak for Grandpa but it is my understanding that the point here is to highlight the bias application of criticism when it comes to protesters.
17comparing any President to H.itler is lame whether its Bush or Obama lets all agree to stop doing that please.
I am gonna jump on the "good idea!" bandwagon on this one!
18But Hypno isn't saying "Drowning out opposing views is simply un-American" the opposite of saying "dissent is un-American"? Isn't she saying that everybody should have a voice even if you don't agree with them?
19I agree Kastarte. Drowning out opposing views is Un-American. Respectful dissent is very much an American value. I think the key is that there be an opportnity for debate.
20Well, Dave, I hate to tell you this but it looks like you agree with Nancy Pelosi. She was not saying dissenters are un-American but that purposefully disrupting meetings and preventing discussion is.
Grandpa, if you don't mind I'm going to paste the USA Today Op-Ed in question up in your post so everyone knows what we're talking about.
21I'm not saying I didn't disagree with her. I'm pointing out that she was conspicousily silent when the people she disagreed with were being shouted downa few years ago.
22Sorry, I meant that as a joke, because I'm guessing you don't agree much with Nancy Pelosi.
23"I'm pointing out that she was conspicousily silent when the people she disagreed with were being shouted downa few years ago."
Pelosi herself was being shouted by anti-war protestors a couple of years ago:
On the day the war began the following month, San Francisco's downtown business district was shut down by thousands of anti-war protesters in a spontaneous act of massive civil disobedience. In response, Pelosi denounced the protesters and rushed to the defense of President George W. Bush, voting in favor of a resolution declaring the House of Representatives' "unequivocal support and appreciation to the president ... for his firm leadership and decisive action." She personally pressed a number of skeptical Democratic lawmakers to support the resolution as well.
http://www.tikkun.org/article.php/20090624093324753
They repeatedly challenged the antiwar resolve of Pelosi and her fellow Democrats, in both the written questions they submitted and the criticism they hollered out.
The antagonistic tone was set early on. The first question, read by a moderator, asked why she hadn't supported an end to funding the war. Her response -- that she would not undercut support for U.S. troops -- was quickly drowned out by shouts and chants of "Bring them home" and "No more money for war."
A group of demonstrators then marched down the aisles and stationed themselves in front of the stage, where -- under the close watch of police and Pelosi's bodyguards -- they stood holding protest signs, occasionally heckling the congresswoman
for the next 90 minutes.
Pelosi stayed largely unruffled throughout, sometimes chiding those who interrupted her but otherwise ignoring their taunts. She repeated her assertions that invading Iraq had been a mistake and that the country had posed no imminent threat to U.S. security. The result, she said, has been a civil war that has turned Iraq into a breeding ground for anti-American terrorists.
http://articles.latimes.com/2006/jan/15/local/me-pelosi15?pg=1
But her spirits soured instantly when somebody asked about the anger of the Democratic ‘base’ over her failure to end the war in Iraq.
24“‘Look,’ she said, the chicken breast on her plate untouched. ‘I had, for five months, people sitting outside my home...I don’t know what they were — couches, sofas, chairs, permanent living facilities on my front sidewalk.’
“Unsmilingly, she continued: ‘If they were poor and they were sleeping on my sidewalk, they would be arrested for loitering, but because they have ‘Impeach Bush’ across their chest, it’s the First Amendment.’
http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2007/10/10/camp-pelosi-nancy-lashes-out-at-t...
"Sorry, I meant that as a joke, because I'm guessing you don't agree much with Nancy Pelosi."
Oh, oops. My bad. You're correct. Pelosi and I don't see eye to eye (That could be because she's taller than me).
25I don't know what there is to argue about really. The fact of the matter is conservatives are conspicuously quiet when liberals are being shouted down and liberals are conspicuously quiet when conservatives are being shouted down even though most on both sides hold the belief that we should refrain from hysterical behavior in these matters.
It comes down to why help the other team and what I am saying when it comes to what you think is right and wrong there should be not team. It's either right or it wrong and call it out when ever it happens.
26*(no) team.
27I haven't seen any footage of conservatives/republicans shouting down the opposing point of view. I'm not saying it hasn't happened, and I agree that it's wrong if it has.
28I think that is what is supposedly happening at these town hall meetings, Dave. Some of those who oppose the plan are raising such a ruckus that no discussion can be had. I think the assumption is that they are all Republicans.
29You're not looking hard enough on youtube then Dave.
30I think what is frustrating is that (IMHO) when a "town meeting" is organized it is usually thought to be a platform to actually LISTEN to the people AND answer questions or concerns.
It goes awry when people there feel their voice will not be heard. If people attending "town meetings" are handpicked, brought in and questions moderated, it ceases to be a "town meeting" and becomes "political pushing" ---Americans are not okay with that.
"Planting" people in crowds on either side to light fires of discontent and misinformation......is the great manipulation and orchestration of the unraveling of America's ability to actually have conversations which are meaningful. It is not I surprising that people are beginning to say----Stop! Listen!
I believe this is their goal (political machine) to divide us all and prevent us from looking at other issues. It is a great distraction technique. Both side KNOW this health reform is not going to fly the way it is written. Neither side likes it...and neither want to stand up and take credit for such poorly thrown together legislation.
31I don't look at Youtube at all. NOt worth my time.
32Then whatever news you're watching to isn't giving full reports, or you would seen Republicans/conservatives shouting down the opposing point of view.
33"I haven't seen any footage of conservatives/republicans shouting down the opposing point of view. I'm not saying it hasn't happened, and I agree that it's wrong if it has."
Isn't that the whole point of this post? Isn't it conservatives disrupting these town hall meetings?
34As I've said, it's wrong if it's happened. I've seen lots of angry citizens voicing their opinion, but I've not seen anyone shouting over someone else.
35If voicing a differing opinion at a microphone is disruption, then yes I guess you are right.
36Based on what you've seen then, I don't understand why you'd criticize Pelosi: "I'm pointing out that she was conspicousily silent when the people she disagreed with were being shouted downa few years ago."
37From the footage I saw on CNN this morning, people have just been yelling stuff out. They haven't been politely voice their opposition into a microphone, they have been standing up and yelling things like "Socialist!" while representatives are trying to answer questions.
38The citizens voicing concerns at the AARP meeting with an AARP official had NO political platforms...they were there as citizens. Why is it so hard to consider the possibility that these people who are raising voices are not there ALSO as citizens?
While I am not crazy about the Hiliary montage--I wish she'd take some of her own advice. A conversation can only occur if everyone is willing to listen. We can point fingers at both sides--many people on all sides must quit yelling. I don't believe our leaders want to listen. I get a feeling they'd rather we sit down, shut up, and be happy to be dictated to.
39I bet it'd be much more amicable if everyone planted little girls to lob softballs in their townhall meetings like Obama.
40Or if Obama handled his the way Bush did:
"...the administration does have the right to try and prevent threats and disruptions from protesters, which is why people are often barred from Bush events, according to White House officials. The removal of individuals can occur before and after a disruption.
“There is an active campaign underway to try and disrupt and disturb his events in hopes of undermining his objective of fixing Social Security,†White House spokesman Trent Duffy told FOXNews.com. “If there is evidence there are people planning to disrupt the president at an event, then they have the right to exclude those people from those events.â€
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,153720,00.html
Three Denver residents yesterday charged that they were forcibly removed from one of President Bush's town meetings on Social Security because they displayed a bumper sticker on their car condemning the administration's Middle East policies.
41http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A10969-2005Mar29.html
I agree. It's much easier to pre-select an agreeable audience to begin with. Obama had the right idea with his "Yes-we-can" chanting cross-section of country at his "townhall."
42Where's grandpa, is he still with Mini?
43Let's see how many people Obama has tossed out or arrested for bumper stickers or t-shirts on this western swing.
44hypno, I have been over doing my volunteer thing all day, besides i doubt I could add anything meaningful to the debate that has not already said. The fact is the majority of Americans are against this boondoggle of a bill, and the president and the Democrats are suffering because of their arrogance in pushing the bill, and their inability to defend a bill that apparently no one can even understand. Notice the AP report today that the Senate is dropping the "end of life" provision from their bill.
I believe that the Democrats are now facing an election disaster along the likes that Clinton administration experienced in his first term interim electoral cycle. The president is twisting arms to get congressional Democrats to vote for something their constituents do not want. Like Clinton he can remain personally popular, but he has no real 'coattails"
45Hypno, Grandpa had to go into the witness protection program to hide from Grandma, and their three sons, who are very protective of grandma.
46"Notice the AP report today that the Senate is dropping the "end of life" provision from their bill."
It was yesterday, it's the Senate Finance Committee and what's been taken out could be revised in a final measure.
If end of living counseling was good enough for GOP senators in 2003, Palin in 2008 and Newt Gingrich LAST MONTH, they'll have to explain why it's seen as death panels today.
47Steph, who cares who supported what in the past. The fact is THE PUBLIC that is up in arms and the politicians recognize that fact.
48if you want to know what the objections to the current health reform plan I posted this on Conservative salt:
http://teamsugar.com/group/2426975/blog/4046427
49Wow - if that isn't a proclamation that it doesn't matter why or how, just so long as Obama is kept from succeeding, I don't know what is.
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